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Post by cross on Aug 23, 2014 7:47:40 GMT -5
I'm working out the story right now and then I saw the rule of no new gods stories.
My story is of Mister Miracle (Scott Free) and Big Barda on a prison transport ship being brought to the planet of Apokalipse. Darkseid would at best be mentioned but never seen or used beyond this. The whole story would be of Miracle and Barda escaping the ship. The "Warden" of the ship would be Kalibak. I haven't worked out my full story yet but other than those three I doubt that I would use any other new gods characters. Mostly I would pull from the greater cosmic stories for characters.
My overall question is would this be approved or are the new gods strictly a no?
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Post by DiscipleofBob on Aug 23, 2014 9:14:05 GMT -5
At this time, Darkseid, New God, and Fourth World characters aren't allowed. This may change in the future, but for now they aren't.
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Post by cross on Aug 23, 2014 11:29:50 GMT -5
What's the reasoning for those characters being off limits?
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Post by DiscipleofBob on Aug 23, 2014 13:21:50 GMT -5
Honestly it's a rule that was in place before I became admin. The only justification I can think of is that Darkseid and Apokolips were being reserved for Justice League or at least didn't want to be claimed for other titles too early.
Although I personally wouldn't mind at this point, but I also wouldn't want to suddenly put characters on the table without some advance notice for other writers.
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Post by cross on Aug 23, 2014 13:25:31 GMT -5
So pretty much no I can't use these characters?
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Post by DiscipleofBob on Aug 23, 2014 13:51:08 GMT -5
At this time, no.
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Post by cross on Aug 24, 2014 6:59:36 GMT -5
How about this. I will put my claims out on this two months early. If no one has a problem with them by October then I can write Ultimate Escape. Sound fair?
Also, I won't use any of the other new gods nor will these characters actually make it to apokalipse.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2014 7:19:21 GMT -5
Well, given that my proposal for Mr. Miracle and Barda was denied, I'd imagine you'd be in a similar sort of situation...as stated above. Twice. I think you might be on to a losing battle here.
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Post by Stardrifter on Aug 24, 2014 8:08:17 GMT -5
At this point a Justice League title is still in a nebulous state of "Sometime in the future." It seems silly to me to turn away someone who wants to write over a rule put in place to hold characters for a title that hasn't come and has no signs of starting any time soon. Especially considering the huge loss of writers and activity lately.
That said, not sure how it could be done fairly as multiple people have wanted to write these characters. But I think something should be done.
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Post by cross on Aug 24, 2014 13:12:13 GMT -5
If manhunter would want to write them then I would be fine with that. I'm just trying to work out a good title to write but restrictions keep getting in the way.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 30, 2014 13:28:16 GMT -5
Given what Star said, and there's been a few people expressing interest in the Fourth War, AND with you saying that you don't really mind if they're used or not, DoB...Are they going to be opened up for release? Or is it still a case of them sitting on the sidelines?
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Post by DiscipleofBob on Aug 30, 2014 13:41:20 GMT -5
IF they get opened for release, it will likely be something like a mini-draft after a month or two so that current writers don't get screwed out of the opportunity to claim them.
I'm not exactly sure what to do with them so that it's fair to everyone.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 30, 2014 15:02:41 GMT -5
That seems fair. Does that mean there is a possibility they will be opened up soon then? Or is this a purely long term/hypothetical situation?
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Post by Question on Sept 1, 2014 22:24:35 GMT -5
I feel like, in a universe as large as the DCU, people are neglecting the idea of using expies instead of characters that are off limits for whatever reason. Want to write Superman but can't? Write Mister Majestic! Want Batman? Write Midnighter! Mister Miracle (Scott Free) Use... okay, this one's harder than the rest. Libra? A random unused Green Lantern like Jack Chance? Use Maxima! Use Despero! Use Lobo! |
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Post by jordan on Sept 2, 2014 8:10:57 GMT -5
I feel like, in a universe as large as the DCU, people are neglecting the idea of using expies instead of characters that are off limits for whatever reason. Want to write Superman but can't? Write Mister Majestic! Want Batman? Write Midnighter! Mister Miracle (Scott Free) Use... okay, this one's harder than the rest. Libra? A random unused Green Lantern like Jack Chance? Use Maxima! Use Despero! Use Lobo! This...is very, very creative! |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2014 14:20:05 GMT -5
While I won't deny it's creativity, if you're simply swapping out one character for another, you're not being true to the character. A New Gods series, in my mind, plays with the conceptions and within the realms of the New Gods.
Darkseid is not Despero, he has his own arc and characterization. People may disagree, but I think it does a disservice to these characters to chop and change them. In my mind, Lobo is nothing like Kalibak, so why try and force Lobo into that mold?
Sure, you could do some gathering of heroes story, about these characters coming together, but that isn't the New Gods story, either. That's something else.
I should say, and should have said at the start, this is my opinion on this - not having a pop.
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Post by Question on Sept 2, 2014 23:14:20 GMT -5
Well, yeah, of course it's not going to be exactly the same. But using other characters instead of your first pick also opens up storytelling possibilities. With Jack Chance over Scott Free, you lose the New God angle but you can explore a renegade GL who got his ring confiscated, just to cherrypick one example.
I'm not suggesting you write a New God story and then run a search and replace on the names. Use someone similar and see where that takes you. Midnighter is a distinct character from Batman, after all, but close enough that you could write them reasonably similar while at the same time taking chances you wouldn't with Batman proper.
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Post by Drake on Sept 3, 2014 21:07:49 GMT -5
It's interesting Question pointed that out, because it's something I've learned to embrace in the past 6 months. When I first joined the site, I had plans and I had to follow those specific plans. No character substitutes were allowed...until eventually I had no choice. Then, I slowly started picking minor or "cheap knock off" characters overtime, simply because I found you could tell a more interesting story because less was expected with the characters. 'Haven is full of them (with the exception of Tim Drake and Cass Cain, simply because Tim's at least a B-lister and Cass is pseudo-established in the mythos and no one was using her).
That's not to say don't use your favorites, or tell the story you want to tell. Some stories require certain characters, like the New Gods for example, but I think it's always the most interesting when people establish new concepts, or at the very least reinvent old ones. To continue with examples, if you claim Batman, people have preconceived notions. If you claim Midnighter, some people might have a few ideas, but no one's going to freak if you change his origin or personality a bit.
Again, look at 'Haven (not mine, but Wachter's story). He took many lower tier Batman sidekicks and characters and created a whole mythos for them that tied into pre-existing stories on UDC and also was set apart by its unique take on much of the characters. His story is a great example of the best storytelling on sites like Ultimate DC. People create new (and I mean REAL new, not another--if reimagined--Batman vs Joker story) plots with not much to lose, simply because of the characters involved.
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