Death is Nigh: Ultimate Suicide Squad Discussion

[Ultimate Silentking]

First issue is up immediatly after the board came up! Hmm. . . it seemed longer on Mircosoft word. Anyway, here is over 2,500 words (Around 2,800 actually) of the villains forced to do suicidial assignments to better help the world in some way! So, what do you think and who is your favorite? (Mine is Ambush Bug right now. His parts are the easiest and most fun to write.)

[The Wonderful Wachter]

As the keeper of continuity, I'm having a difficult time placing this on our timeline when Electrocutioner is mentioned as taking place several days following the Parasite Incident and I'm pretty sure that had to be in the June-August 2011 Range whereas Flag's squad (which shares members with this) was formed in November and the Captain Atom incident was circa December 2011. So does this happen before Checkmate or after?

Continuity aside. Strong start and I always appreciate a reference to other series as you did with Ambush Bug. Not too shabby for someone your age. I only hope you can keep the quality up when you restart school (since I'm assuming this will be your senior year).

I look forward to seeing more and after reading your first issue, I see no problem in letting you use Cluemaster whenever you want since he was a member of Flag's team. Maybe I'll even shoot you my outline for the backup I was gonna do for Buck with their adventures in Bialya.

[Ultimate Silentking]

...crap. This is suppose to be after the Checkmate. Let me discuss with Buck about this since we are both working on Superman. I will probably edit the issue sometime this month to edit that mistake. Also, I already graduated from senior year. I am trying to get into college though. In fact, I am gonna go take an assessment test today. And thanks for the compliment. I am hoping to become a writer when I become older.

[liquidsword34]

I liked this issue, you've set up the team well and given them all distinct personalities. A few proof reading issues such as overuse of "then" and changes in tense ie:

The man then wistfully grabs even more money and puts it into his sack. “Maybe I should go to Blüdhaven? I hear that there is this new superhero there called Spoiler. I even hear rumors that Spoiler is actually a girl! Maybe I can get her to go on a date with me sometime?” After stuffing the sack, the man teleported back to his hideout.

It went from present to past tense. I'll also say that while I like Ambush Bug, make sure not to make him too comedic so as to sort of kill off his likeability. Being random and kooky is all well and good, but if that's all he is it'll get grating.

[elite147]

I enjoyed the story of the first issue. It did jump between past and present tense a lot, but I didn't mind that, I thought the flpw was pretty good. You goddamned ambush bug was the best part, and I look forward to more character development on him and Hugo. The only real problem I had was thaat I felt the dialogue was lacking, it felt dry and rehearsed. That might just have been me, but oh well. Look forward to your Action Conmics.

-Elite

[Ultimate Silentking]

Issue 2 is up. I would like to thank Elite for agreeing to help me edit this and pointing out some of the more bigger flaws in the original draft. I probably missed some of the more minor flaws, the whole over use of the word "then" and switching past and present tense, but I swear I did my best to remove those mistakes. Hopefully the fight scene won't be so confusing to Elite as the original draft was. I am certain it is much cleaner that the original version, but the question is how much cleaner? Anyway, feel free to point out any flaws that are in this issue, what your favorite part is, and who your favorite Suicide Squad in this issue was.

For me, my favorite Squad member is still Ambush Bug and my favorite scene was the final one. The park scene was a close second though.

[Ultimate Silentking]

Updated the Notes of Professor Hugo Strange for a quick analysis of Ambush Bug.

[liquidsword34]

If I'm honest I didn't like this issue much.

The bar scene was kind of disjointed. One thing which bugged me:

I estimate that out of the fifty here, thirty of them are our targets. This also includes the bartender, which suggests that practically everyone here is part of the terrorist group.

Thirty out of fifty isn't practically everyone, and the two scenarios (Practically everyone vs 30/50) are very different.

Later on you then put:

By Tiger’s count there are only about thirty of the fifty men that was in the bar left. Lester must have taken a few down while Ben was making sure that the guy he will be pumping information out of was in a safe place. That and the smart ones must have got the hell out of dodge.

But weren't there thirty terrorists before? Unless loads of none terrorists just sat and watched, it doesn't add up.

It takes me out the story as a reader. Most of the actual writing was quite bland. It gave the basic facts, but not any flair or detail. The long fight scene didn't mention how Tiger fights, for example. Was he swift and agile like a ninja? Brutal and slow like Batman? A street fighter who was clumsy and used his strength? the details make it interesting.

As with the first issue, the tense changed quite often, sometimes even in mid paragraph. It makes it difficult for the reader to follow. A few times I did a quick sort of double take because of it.

[Ultimate Silentking]

Okay, I will use this issue as a reminder of what I should approve on for the next one. How long do I have before I have to release the next one? I want to take some time on the third one to make it much better than the first two.

Edit: I think I know what went wrong. I was too focused on getting to the Mad Hatter storyline and I also wanted to make sure that I reach continuity by the time I do. I will try to focus more on the next two issues. Also, any other complaints? All I got from you was the fight scene (The hardest to write actually) and complaints found in my first issue. What about the other characters and scenes? There is more than the bar fight.

[The Wonderful Wachter]

I shall read it tomorrow when I'm killing time away from the exterminator but you have until the end of September to get another issue out. You also have two more claims you can use if you'd like as this is your first go and they expire at the end of the month, reducing you down to the standard three.

[elite147]

My thoughts on the second issue pretty much remain the same as they did a few days ago. The fight is less confusing now, and you did better explain yourself on some things.

Multiplex remains my favorite. Same for his scene in this issue. This title has a lot of potential and I look forward to Issue #3, and, since you are oh so excited for it, I am kind of hyped up for the Hatter arc.

-Elite

[Ultimate Silentking]

I don't think you will like the ending of the Mad Hatter arc, Elite. But then again, it depends on whether your opinion on certain things will change or not. Also, I am now adding poll that will have you guess who will die first. I already planned ahead of which Squad members will make it out in the end, but I have not decided what order except for the first one.

[unchartedfan1]

Your suicide squad is rather tasteless to be honest. Your characters are one-dimensional and your villains means and methods are weak when they are actually expanded upon. The only part of your series I like so far is how diverse your characters are from each other. I plan to keep reading through issue #12 so you have that much time to change my mind.

First 2 issues: 4.5/10

[liquidsword34]

Aug 25, 2012 20:35:31 GMT -5 @unchartedfan1 said:

Your suicide squad is rather tasteless to be honest. Your characters are one-dimensional and your villains means and methods are weak when they are actually expanded upon. The only part of your series I like so far is how diverse your characters are from each other. I plan to keep reading through issue #12 so you have that much time to change my mind.

Wow, very constructive, mature and balanced criticism there.

[unchartedfan1]

It's just how I feel about the series.

[Deleted]

I've only read the first issue so far, so my comments will be limited to that.

It's an interesting start in terms of premise and cast. The writing has potential, but has flaws as well. It reads like a first draft, and to be honest I hate reading first drafts. Even the first drafts of the best writers to have put pen to page or finger to keyboard are flawed and not really suitable for reading.

I have been doing this a long time (not fan fiction, but reading and writing, both professionally and for fun. One of the greatest weaknesses of young writers (and by young I mean in terms of writing experience, not age) is impatience. They are in a hurry to get what they've written in front of other eyes, and in a rush to have written not to write.

Writing is a process. Getting the ideas in your head onto the page is only the first step, not the last. Once that is done the real work is needed. Edit, polish, rewrite, revise, etc. Once your first draft is done, the place it should go is in a drawer, not in front of other eyes, unless you have a writing circle or a reader who gives you feedback as part of the process. After it sits for at least a day, then you go back and reread it, see what works, what doesn't and begin the actual writing process.

This is where you see things you miss while typing or writing on the page-things like missing words, tense changes, plot holes, unnatural dialogue, grammar and usage errors, typos, etc.
We all have been guilty of rushing things out there or not giving manuscripts the proper love and TLC, of not doing the real work of writing. Hell I have been guilty of it recently, which was part of the frustration that lead to my break (or breakdown if you prefer).

The myth is that writing is about inspiration, the truth is writing is about perspiration. There's a lot of potential here and room for growth, the question is are you willing to do the work to have it reach that potential.
-M

[Deleted]

Read issue 2 and more of the same from my initial impression-has potential but flawed.

Here's an example of how a proofreading error totally changes the mood and tenor of the story...

"The Electrocutioner doesn’t say anything and sits at an empty table as Bronze Tiger heads toward one of the stools. The man is weary of the many eyes staring at him. Both Suicide Squad members can sense the suspicion and bloodlust emitting from everyone. The chances of getting the information they want without starting a fight is extremely low. As low as the chances of none of the members of the Suicide Squad losing their lives."

So Bronze Tiger is tired of the eyes on him? That's what you tell me by what you've written, which portrays him as resigned, fatigued, and ready for the mission to be over and his time with the Squad is a chose and one he no longer wants to be a part of of. That is the sense of character that comes with one being weary of all the eyes on him.

However, I think you meant he was wary or watchful and attentive, which portrays him as someone on the ball, ready for what is going to happen and possible eager for the mission. That fits better with what happens, but it is not what you told me as the reader with what you wrote.

This is the problem with manuscripts where the time to edit, revise, polish, etc. has either not been put in or was not done effectively. The end result is the writer writes something other than they intended and it changes the feel and tone of the story.

Another issue for me...if you are going to set a story in Paris..make it feel like Paris not a random American city with the Eiffel Tower in it. Don't set something in a random park-do a little research and find a Parisian park to set it in and used that setting to add flavor and feel to your story. It's not that hard with google, not like you have to go to a library and get out a travel book on Paris-though that is an option as well and a deeply hidden writer secret-a great tool for building setting for a writer is to buy or borrow one of the Fodor's or similar guides for the city you want to set something in.Give's you lots of things to use to set your story properly and make your settings add to the story.

Third thing-if the Suicide Squad is supposed to be covert and competent, you haven't shown it, they come across as the Bad News Bears of black ops teams. If that is your intent, congrats, you succeeded.

Few things-intel...if they know the owner of the bar, they should be able to find the money trail to other linked locations and possible higher ups.

A terrorist group is called a cell usually, or at least in the parlance of the intelligence community. A large group will be broken down into smaller cells, not usually hanging around in large groups and often there is little contact between individual cells with only higher ups having knowledge of more than one or two cells to coordinate efforts.

So who are your terrorists? Just a bunch of random people with kids who want to blow up the Eiffel Tower? Why? What's their motivation? What do they want to accomplish by blowing up the tower? If they are trying to acquire needed explosives, why not do a covert op to pose as arms dealers to find out who is further up the food chain of the terrorist groups? Most terrorists won't have a clue who is higher up so interrogation won't reveal much, this is intentional on most competent cells part to protect them should some of the cells be compromised and apprehended.

Again, a little research helps to add the kind of details that make a story believable. Verisimilitude. It reads more like a spoof of a covert op vs. terrorist cell than an actual story in the genre because of the lack of believable details and grounding in reality. More Meet the Spartans than 300 in tone and style. If that is your goal, then great. If not, it's time to put the nose to the grindstone and start crafting better attempts at stories.

There is a lot of potential here-the set up could be very interesting, the plot could work, the character interactions could be compelling, etc. there are seeds there, but they are not sprouting yet and the potential is laying unfulfilled.

There is a lot of room for growth here, and I think with honest work at improving the craft, something very good could result here. Otherwise I wouldn't take time to comment. But for me, it's not there yet.

-M